If Atheism is a religion, CFI is its Vatican
The question that needs to be addressed today is: Who is behind the growing freethought movement in Canada, and how much control do they have?
CFI Transnational - aka "The Vatican of Atheism"
Pictured above is the headquarters of the Center For Inquiry in Amherst, New York (just outside Buffalo) and the major leaders of freethought in Canada, John Xu, Katie Kish and Justin Trottier.
While not quite as glamourous, the main headquarters of the Centre For Inquiry Canada / Ontario can be seen here:
These pictures are from my trip to the CFI Student Leadership Conference last summer which I documented in several stages (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and 7). Overall, the conference was a blast, despite some rumours, that I ignored then, about the heavy-handedness of some of the leadership.
But recently, and especially as CFI has been expanding, I've begun to question how this movement in Canada, and abroad, is structured.
In the USA, there's no shortage of freethought/secular/skeptic/humanist/atheist/rationalist/any-other-name-you-can-put-to-it (henceforth I will refer to all of these groups as "secular" except in the case of specific groups) groups that exist. See the following chart for a rough diagram of how they all fit together (h/t Friendly Atheist) (also note that this chart is over 2 years old, and applies primarily to the USA):
Not exactly simple right? And there's a lot more overlap in the work that they do then is self evident.
For a simple example, a new secular campus group can seek funding, pamphletting materials, startup packages (including sample constitutions and event suggestions) and speakers bureaus from both the Secular Student Alliance and CFI-On Campus. For a new group starting up, the only difference is the resources available to each.
Luckily for new student groups, these umbrella groups don't force their campus chapters to be exclusive or conform to any objectives of the umbrella. So long as you promote freethinking in some fashion, the SSA and CFI will support you (often simultaneously).
So what does the organizational chart of Freethought in Canada look like?
There is also a "Skeptics Canada" group, but it's website hasn't been touched for two years, so I excluded it.
As far as I can tell, none of the organizations in Canada have a member-elected board, and the Freethought Association of Canada is a registered charity.
Unfortunately or not, there's not actually as much diversity of ideas as that graphic leads on.
If our example is of CFI Transnational being the Vatican, then founder Paul Kurtz would have been the Pope (until he was recently relieved of his duties by the new president Ron Lindsay - again h/t Friendly Atheist for coverage of that scandal). Continuing the analogy, CFI Canada would then be an Archdiocese and Justin Trottier would be Archbishop of Canada.
Justin didn't start with CFI though. His first group was the University of Toronto Secular Alliance, which eventually spawned the Freethought Association of Canada, now headed by Katie Kish (pictured above).
After the TSA/FAC, with help from Amherst, Justin founded CFI Ontario (which has become CFI Canada), where he remains executive director to this day.
But that still wasn't enough for him, and he presides over the Canadian Secular Alliance.
Finally, the Canadian Atheist Bus Campaign was started by FAC, but atheistbus.ca is registered to Chris Hammond, who organizes the campaign for FAC.
So out of the four major secular organizations in Canada, Justin Trottier founded or currently runs three of them. He has proven to be quite the success for secularism in Canada, earning quite the media repetoire of interviews, TV panels and nationally-syndicated columns. He literally has become the "face of atheism" in Canada.
But looking back through his career, I pause to ask, when did the Evil Atheist Conspiracy proclaim him our saviour from above spokesperson?
Actually, that question doesn't really bother me. He did a lot of leg work for the movement and worked his way from campus organizing to taking on leaders of the Canadian Christian Right (something I got to try too).
But now that the movement is really becoming visible, it's time to stop and question if it's time for a change in direction for at least one of these organizations?
Now, in his spare time Justin also finds time to run a blog over at Equalism Activism, but I can almost guarantee you it's not exactly what you'd expect. From the statement on his site:
We believe in equalism, not equity. Provide people equal opportunities, be they atheists and theists, secularists and religious, or men and women; groups should not be subject to social engineering meant to enforce equality of results or systematically bias our neutral public spaces.
This blog is dedicated to the defense of those seemingly all powerful in our society:1) Scientists: pioneering inquirers, denigrated as arrogant elitists,
2) Rationalists: searching for truth with openness and fallibility, lambasted by the postmodern left and the religious right
3) Secularists: striving to maintain church-state separation, squeezed between religious accommodationists and multicultural ideologues,
4) Men: who die younger, are at greater risk of the top ten causes of death, suffer legal biases against fathers, are denounced in the media, are greater victims of violent crime, yet can't stop apologizing for their gender
We speak for those groups supposedly invulnerable to slander...not because we believe in censorship and wish to silence our critics. Just the opposite. Because we believe in the most uncompromising freedom of expression. So we're going to say some things that need to be said.
That last one will catch a lot of freethinkers off guard for a second or two. The Men's Rights movement is definitely controversial, and I know from personal discussions with secular activists who would otherwise be more involved with CFI (which is currently the pre-eminent secular organization in Canada) have shyed away due to several of Justin's statements at Equalism Activism and on his Facebook page.
In an ideal society we could keep his men's rights work separate from his secular work (as I've similarly tried to keep my NDP campaigning apart from my secular work), but there's going to be slips, and the media/public may not always draw the lines that ought to be there.
Case in point, Justin recounts in one post how he was contacted for an interview for the Atheist Bus Campaign (a frequent occurrence), and claims the person securing the interview immediately jumped to FACs then Vice President, Katie Kish for the interview (supposedly for the sexist reasons of misrepresenting the number of females in atheist organizations). Justin writes:
They immediately targeted Katie as the ideal guest (they didn’t even ask about Chris [Hammond, organizer of the atheist bus initiative]), as she is female and they are looking to increase the presence of female voices. Is this a CBC policy, I asked. No, just an unofficial practice. So you would rather speak to the Vice President then the President of the Association, I asked. Well, I’m sure you’re both equally capable spokespeople, was the reply (this is from memory so it may not be exact). Now Katie is more then qualified and she had already fielded loads of these interviews, but there was no attempt at all by this producer to differentiate us in other more meaningful ways, such as by experience, involvement in this campaign, or other accomplishments. It was all about gender.
I told them, very calmly, that I found this sexist, both against men who work hard to earn the leadership of organizations, and against women. Think about it. The media is effectively hiding the real position of females within NGO’s if they pretend they have more power within the organization then they really do, and that’s hardly helpful towards improving the real status of women if that is something they are concerned with. It cuts both ways, right? Anyway, they decided to have me on the air, but ended up emailing later in the day to cancel the segment, no reason given. I would have worried more, had I not already done like 30 radio spots (in fact, I was at CBC studios fielding 6 radio interviews in a row when that particular email came through).
Perhaps I’m being paranoid, but that was only one of two interviews to cancel on me, and the other gave a damn good excuse - coverage of the Tamil Tigers.
One commenter states that Justin's behaviour was very "unprofessional." And I'd have to agree. Not everyone has an agenda, and even if they do, leave your mysogony to your personal life, on that telephone Justin, you were representing CFI and by extension of the bus campaign, all atheists in Canada.
I've seen some of the groups in Ontario and across Canada, and there's one thing most atheist groups have in common: an overabundance of testoterone. If that interviewer wanted to put up a female voice to counter the repeated white-male voices, all the better for us to look diverse and inclusive.
So this brings me to my current state of mind.
The secular movement in Canada is just shy of Justin Trottier's personal movement. Not only that, there seems to be little to no check on his power within the organizations he controls.
Several of these groups have mysterious boards of directors (that I've never met nor heard of) and an array of executive officers, but none are accountable to actual atheists across Canada. If anything, CFI Transnational in Amherst has more control over the secular movement in Canada then actual Canadians do (remind you of anything?).
Luckily, CFI has exerted very little control over its local communities and centres. CFI Calgary, which became CFI Alberta, was structured entirely from the grassroots by activists in the province. As more Edmontonians started joining CFI Calgary, Cliff Erasmus, the director of CFI Calgary, worked out a multi-city partnership which formed CFI Alberta. This is the first time that the Center for Inquiry has ever set up a community across multiple cities, and so far it seems to be a success.
Each Centre/Community is basically free to decide their own objectives, just so long as they fall under the Centre for Inquiry's broad overarching mission statement.
And this is not to diminish the work of Justin, he definitely championed for autonomy for the local Canadian Communities and Centres to Amherst, and a lot of what's been accomplished in establishing this movement must be accredited to him.
Yet each local Centre/Community remains a microcosm of the greater issue that plagues CFI: members aren't in control. Even the Unitarian Universalists elect their leadership. And half of them are atheists already (note: made up statistic)!
For the Center For Inquiry to truly place itself and secular humanism as a legitimate alternative to established religions, it must do things differently then the religions.
While it is likely easier to run an organization like a business and merely push secularism as a product for the Canadian culture to consume, and this tactic could likely be highly successful in this world, I don't think that's the kind of organization that many activists want to be part of. I know I'm personally growing increasingly uneasy with this situation as it exists - and I say this having been given a role as "Campus Regional Coordinator" for all the universities from Victoria to Winnipeg (not exactly manageable for a full-time student with no travel budget).
Meanwhile, the Secular Student Alliance, mentioned earlier, operates more ideally, with a board that is elected by the paid members of the organization (another perk of paying to join the SSA). The board then appoints, and holds responsible, the executive director and other staff of the organization.
If it all comes down to money, at least the prospect of a minor bit of control over the organization you're buying into would likely push further to sell a few more CFI memberships.
I recall talk a while back of CFI moving towards an elected board, but since Ron Lindsay assumed the presidency of the organization, no obvious moves have been made.
I can nearly guarantee you that every campus group affiliated with CFI holds their leadership accountable to their members, so its time for the big boys (sic) in Toronto and Amherst to face their membership.
If they're doing a good job, they should have nothing to worry about.
Once final note, you can read the email I sent to Justin Trottier, D.J. Grothe, and Ron Lindsay with my concerns here. If I get a reply, I'll let you know.
Definitely not a Liberal campaign video
This video was sent to me by a reader, it's only had a couple hundred views, and bears no party signatures, and was posted by "thecanadianblogger" who only signed up a few days ago...
Reading the info attached to the video definitely points to this being a Conservative video, maybe we'll get to see it on TV soon (which would be an awesome way to go from Liberal bland but positive to Con muddy attack):
Who is Michael Ignatieff. After living abroad for three decades, calling America his country, he now says he shares your values. But does he?
We can do better than…, remixed
Original idea from Kinch Blog and remix inspired by Accidental Deliberations.
Remains free to be spread.
And just to note: The confidence vote button will remain up until we actually see Ignatieff back his tough talk up with a vote.
Update:Kudos to Devin Johnston for the final version.

Liberal, Tory, same old story – in ads
The new Liberal ads are out to much fanfare and swooning at Libblogs, although to be fair, any video with Ignatieff in it would have that crowd swooning.
The Jurist at Accidental Deliberations points out that these ads are "inoffensive and vaguely positive" and bare a resemblance to a certain sweater-vest wearing politician of the last election.
This of course prompted me to find the sweater vest ads and compare.
First, Ignatieff's new English ad (there's just the one for now):
Lot's of big notions and words and attempts to reach at "hope" and working with China and India. Oddly enough he still hasn't given us one Liberal plank. Basically he's saying "I'm better than Harper because I say so." Please, Iggy, let us know what you stand for, because so far you don't seem to stand for anything. And you know what they say about those who stand for nothing.
Now, Harper and the Conservatives released eight different warm and fuzzy sweater vest ads!
Not to defend the man, but at least his team knows about media strategy (like not launching your ad online on Labour Day weekend when no one's paying attention). I won't post all eight embedded (the links are below), but he does approach a number of different issues and some really try to play to his base with talk of family and foreign policy.
- Soft on crime does not work
- A nation of immigrants
- Family is everything
- Strong foundation
- True North strong and free
- Lest we forget
And since it somewhat relates to Ignatieff's "Worldview" ad, here's Canada has to stand for something:
So all-in-all, I'd have to say that Harper's sweater vest ads are actually better on the whole than Iggy's vague lost in the woods thing.
Still my favourite is Marg, Princess Warrior's take on the Sweater Vests:
Finally, let's remember that even though the NDP ran radio ads criticizing Ignatieff for backing out of the coalition in January, they had these classy "Chalk Talk" ads during the election (of course I may be biased):
Update: Here's the comment I left at BigCityLib Strikes Back who's trying to defend the use of Bland ads:
There's positive and then there's bland. While I have nothing against positive ads, why does Iggy refuse to give anything of substance? Where does he stand on Afghanistan, EI, the tar sands and other issues? Instead of answering this we get bland, and that's what's wrong about these ads.
Conservatives rewrite Bob Rae’s rewriting of 2008 coalition
Oh Conservative.ca, you spin so much I might fall off my chair.
Bob Rae Re-Writing Coalition History
September 04, 2009Bob Rae is trying to re-write history. Yesterday, he told a radio interviewer that, “there was no Coalition with the separatists.”
Bob Rae is trying to re-write history.
Yesterday, he told a radio interviewer that, “there was no Coalition with the separatists.”
Interviewer: “You’re saying Michael Ignatieff did not sign that document with Jack Layton and Gilles Duceppe?”
Bob Rae: “No, he did not. Michael Ignatieff no never did.”
(AM 770 CHQR, September 3, 2009)Here is the Coalition document calling on the Governor General to overturn the results of the 2008 election and install a Coalition government led by the Liberals. You can see Ignatieff’s signature clearly on it.
There was no "coalition" between the Liberals and the "separatists," there was an agreement that the Bloc would not bring down the Liberal-NDP coalition for 2 years. Bob Rae is not lying, but I can't say the same for the CPC.
Then there's the bullshit "overturn the results of the 2008 election" line again. I don't think it's that the HarperCons don't understand our parliamentary democracy, but that they deliberately attempt to misrepresent it, as Harper wants to be President of Canada (only with more power than the USA president).
Here's Bob Rae's original audio (on the right of the article).
Bob defends himself, but of course, the quote mining and attack questioning dragged the responses seen on QR77s website and Conservative.ca.
Still in the far SW corner of the compass
Here's my current standing in the Political Compass. Over the past few years that I've taken it I haven't moved far from that bottom left corner. Maybe one day I'll grow out of my democratic-socialist tendencies like all these neo-con commenters keep saying, but until then I'll keep reaching for that Utopia.
Economic Left/Right: -8.62
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.36
I’ve incited the Defenders of the Truth(tm) part 2
Any time you attack a conspiracy, the Defenders of the TruthTM always seem to crawl from the woodwork to smack you down with further gibberish and then scream of censorship.
So let's look at MAnderson and AAW's comments on my post "Wind Concerns Ontario, and the sun doesn't?"
MAnderson:
Funny you should mention Wikipedia. Is this your master source of information you turn to in order to give validity to a subject?
My goodness. Give your head a shake. This is Wikipedia we’re talking about!
There has been a long standing battle with Wiki to get a balanced view on the subject. They immediately delete anything that offends their paridigm. [sic] One moderator even said “But this might hurt the wind industry” as his basis for removing the information. They are blinded by ideology (much like yourself) and refuse to allow anything to do with WTS on their site.
When the words "paradigm," "blinded by ideology" and un-sourced quotes (remember, Wikipedia talk pages maintain most debates on the issues) are trotted out, you likely have one of two options:
A. Wikipedia is clearly biased against the TruthTM and won't accept their articles without scholarly sources.
B. They have no scientific backing and are therefore not notable enough to even be worth mentioning.
Perhaps they might be able to get an article over at Conservapedia (which just so unfortunately is having server issues right now).
Why did I go first to Wikipedia? Maybe because while their information isn't always the most thorough, it is generally unbiased, and a relatively high quality of encyclopedia (as good as real encyclopedias). Suffice it to say, if you're not in Wikipedia, you're not that important.
You didn’t mention the survey led by Dr. McMurtry, former Dean of Medicine at the University of Western Ontario. You didn’t mention the work done by Dr’s in the UK, Australia and the US. You didn’t mention that reports of these same symptoms are being reported by hundreds of people in Australia, Japan and the US. No, you chose to do what most who are confronted with this information do, attack Dr. Pierpont personally.
Of course I didn't mention those studies! I don't have the references to all your random articles. They aren't listed by Ms. Pierpont on her website, and they aren't linked to anywhere on your own WCO website. Who's suppressing information now?
As far as I can tell from a quick Google Scholar search, shows only Ms. Pierpont showing up for "wind turbine syndrome," a clear call that her views aren't even narrowly accepted. You can find a pdf of a draft of her book this way though.
Unfortunately, I can't find Dr. McMurtry's paper (note: the survey link that's buried on WCO's website takes you to this 404 page), perhaps you could enlighten me with a real reference, as well as some others so I may be as privileged to the TruthTM as you are.
After my spam filter ate most of MAnderson's posts (which I recovered after awakening this morning), he flipped out and posted this friendly response:
Censoring my information, are you? I’m no longer allowed to post here? Obviously your need to be “right” outweighs your compassion to people.
Yep, I'm officially as evil as Wikipedia. Don't disagree with my obscure science/atheism/political blog or I'll delete your comment! I get all of a few dozen readers and I'll be damned before they see a competing view.
Or maybe you just overposted or something, I don't know what happened, my SpamKarma plugin ate them, and I made it spit them out. I've left worse comments online then yours MAnderson.
Then my favourite comment from AAW:
Bat Lungs are Exploding because of Wind Turbines…..do you think bats do this intentionally to create alarm to the NIMBY’ist position? Get real.
No link, no mention of a study, just a bunch of capitalized words that resemble a sentence. I have to assume it's in reference to this University of Calgary study, which proposes the following explanation (which have no relation to claims of "infrasound" or noise levels) and solutions:
The movement of wind-turbine blades creates a vortex of lower air pressure around the blade tips similar to the vortex at the tip of aeroplane wings. Others have suggested that this could be lethal to bats, but until now no-one had carried out necropsies to verify the theory.
...
One solution could be to increase the minimum wind speed needed to set the blades in motion. Most bats are more active in low wind.
So remember my conclusion?
Some sceptics admit it’s likely if the low frequency noise disrupts your sleep there’s some cause for concern, but agree that it shouldn’t be that hard to just limit turbines to a radius of a few kilometres from residences.
Move wind turbines and people apart and no problem. WCO seems to find the only justifiable response to be to ban all wind turbines (of course they offer no mission statement on their website, and just vague attacks on "industrial wind power"). Now that's reasonable.
So what does a real scientific paper have to say about wind turbine's and health?
Abstract from: E. Pedersen et. al., "Response to noise from modern wind farms in The Netherlands," J. Accoust. Soc. Am. 126 (2) pp. 634-643, August 2009.
The increasing number and size of wind farms call for more data on human response to wind turbine noise, so that a generalized dose-response relationship can be modeled and possible adverse health effects avoided. This paper reports the results of a 2007 field study in The Netherlands with 725 respondents. A dose-response relationship between calculated A-weighted sound pressure levels and reported perception and annoyance was found. Wind turbine noise was more annoying than transportation noise or industrial noise at comparable levels, possibly due to specific sound properties such as a “swishing” quality, temporal variability, and lack of nighttime abatement. High turbine visibility enhances negative response, and having wind turbines visible from the dwelling significantly increased the risk of annoyance. Annoyance was strongly correlated with a negative attitude toward the visual impact of wind turbines on the landscape. The study further demonstrates that people who benefit economically from wind turbines have a significantly decreased risk of annoyance, despite exposure to similar sound levels. Response to wind turbine noise was similar to that found in Sweden so the dose-response relationship should be generalizable.
Even from just the abstract, we see a lot of the annoyance is a psychological result of NIMBYism. If you don't like wind turbines, they're likely to bother you more and you're likely to get more sick when you're stressed.
I wonder if the first people to live near airports or roads got as annoyed and as sick. What if in 30 years when there's wind turbines everywhere no one cares anymore?
Finally, this is for MAnderson:
I’ve incited the Defenders of the Truth(tm) part 1
In response to my post on H1N1 anti-vaxxers in Vancouver, I received the following email:
Hello Ian,
I just finished reading your piece re. Vancouver and "conspiracy theorists" which put forth several flawed assumptions:
1- No one "crashed" the Kevin Annette event. Kevin Annette actually addressed the very issue of the N1H1 flu and its relevance to indigenous populations at a downtown rally only a short while before he spoke at the VPL. Furthermore, he INVITED the audience to come hear him at the library where he said he would also address the issue of how smallpox was deliberately spread to such populations historically.
2- Infering that those who organized the rally are tied to/influenced by www.legitgov.org has no basis. That same flyer cited The Center for Disease and Research Policy, The World Health Organization, The Times of India, The Telegraph and a number of other sources in the quotes included. Furthermore, the citation by legitgov.org re. vaccine manufacturers being exempt from liability in the event of vaccine induced damages has been alluded to by scientists like Professor Emeritus of Genetics, Joe Cummins of The University of Western Ontario, Dr. Tom Jefferson, European epidemiologist etc. Citing a source does not infer you are tied to that source... Our group is made up of individuals of diverse backgrounds and areas of expertize including teaching, nursing, science and research who've come together out of concerns re. the lack of transparency and questioning re. H1N1 and its fast tracked vaccine.
3-Re. the "crazies" on the flyer. No one in Vancouver wrote the words from The Project of the New American Century re. "targeting specific genotypes", nor did anyone locally write; it's "not determined if the virus was a natural mutation or bio-engineered. Many fear the latter." That came from the Pentagon's 'Air Force 2025' written in 1996. Nor did anyone locally create the image 'Epidemics Made to Order' which was taken from 'Science Digest', April 1951. No one in Vancouver forced Washington DC medical director of the DCHHS to say "This strain of swine flu influenza that's been cultured in a lab.." HE made that comment, not us. And Neurosurgeon and MD, Dr. Russell Blaylock gave his article that "omminus" title not us. As for him quoting the well respected journal Virology re. the strange origins of the 2009 N1H1, other respected scientists have rightly questioned the origins of the latest human-avian-swine concoction, too. The flyer was simply a compilation of a few of many quotes "from the horse's mouth."
Lastly, as one of a number of individuals who attended Kevin's talk re. residential schools after leaving the Art Gallery, I find your accusation and, once again, assumption that those who came "craftily" only did so re. the swine flu absurd and insulting. I personally know individuals who raised questions at the VPL (at the Art Gallery) only one or two of whom alluded to the H1N1. These people have known Kevin for years and respected his work re. exposing the crimes committed by residential schools ... Once again, it was Kevin who spoke to the implications of H1N1 re. indigenous grops at the rally, and invited people to hear him at the VPL comment further re. smallpox etc.
Your comments are way off base,
Alright, regarding point 1, I did not have access to the knowledge that the anti-vaxxers were invited by the host. So it wasn't so much as a lecture that was "crashed" as one where everyone but the hosts (CFI-Vancouver) had drank the anti-vax Kool-Aid.
Point 2: The reason I linked them to legitgov.org is because that's where the exact flier they handed out came from. It's not a matter of citation, it's a matter of handing out some wacky fringe groups propaganda. If I handed out Conservative Party fliers, but said it was merely about the information on them, I'd still be a Tory hack.
I'm really not sure what point 3 is trying to get across, but if you hand out information from someone who says wildly outlandish things, I can thereby accuse you of the same.
Now he makes another point (this one isn't numbered), where he feels like my comments were "absurd and insulting," which, ironically, is how I feel about people who fear-monger about vaccines which are there to increase herd immunity to the masses. The residents of the Lower Eastside and aboriginal reserves are likely at a higher risk of exposure to H1N1 due to unsanitary conditions, and therefore the government feels that vaccinating them could save lives and prevent further spread of the disease.
I'm not going to concede being off base, because frankly, a flier from some conspiracy site isn't going to convince me that your conspiracies are anything but just that.
And as for Kevin Annette, who was asked by CFI to speak on the topic of residential schools, I'll hold him at fault for hijacking our meeting and taking it into quackery.
While he may have done some good work with the victims of those atrocities, it doesn't make him immune from irrationality.
Wind Concerns Ontario, and the sun doesn’t?
There's a new Coalition in Ontario, no not a political, NDP-Con / Con-Lib / Con-Bloc / Lib-NDP-Bloc type, instead it's:
...a province wide coalition of thirty-three grassroots organizations in twenty-one counties and the City of Toronto that seeks to raise awareness about the impacts of industrial wind power facilities on health, the environment, the economy and the quality of life.
And it goes by the name of Wind Concerns Ontario.
Chaired by former-Liberal Blogger John Laforet, this group is getting press for opposing the Government of Ontario's attempt to put those dastardly green wind turbines across the province.
Laforet and his coalition have clearly read "Wind Turbine Syndrome" by Dr. Nina Pierpont. Note, this is a book, not a scientific paper. I'd come across this website months ago, but dismissed it too out of hand to even blog.
So what is WTS?
Don't look to Wikipedia, because it doesn't even get notability for its own page. Hell, even the "Environmental effects of wind power" page doesn't mention it. It even says on the talk page:
Health effects
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Health effects of wind power was today closed as "delete", but much of the material immediately re-appeared in this article at Environmental effects of wind power#Health effects (see [1]) so the questionable content hasn't been deleted at all. As I say, the article is to be deleted, not merged, so I am removing the merged content. Johnfos (talk) 21:21, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
I agree, the closing rationale of the deletion discussion was that "While some articles do not need peer reviewed sources, those, that deal with scientific issues, such as health, do. If this is to be a serious article, it needs relevant basis. If those are found, the article should be written again. Until then, no article is better." Hence, the contents of that article should not have been copied by their creator to appear in this article - rst20xx (talk) 23:30, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
WTS is claimed to be a set of symptoms experienced by a select few who live near wind turbines. The research is thin and not widely accepted.
Some sceptics admit it's likely if the low frequency noise disrupts your sleep there's some cause for concern, but agree that it shouldn't be that hard to just limit turbines to a radius of a few kilometres from residences.
Nevertheless, the media loves to overstate the results of Dr. Peirpont's "research" which greatly fails the test of scientific legitimacy.
Greyhound wants out? Time for mass-public transit!
Greyhound says it can't afford Northern Manitoba or Ontario to continue doing business, so it's pulling out, leaving many rural communities stranded.
Seeing as Greyhound is a Texas based company, perhaps the most economically stimulating solution (to our economy) would be (rather than bailing out foreign interests which would save 20-100 jobs of drivers and station managers) to invest in a public transit option.
In fact, there's a few options here.
The governments could opt to buy out Greyhound's business in the provinces, thereby providing public busing between the towns and cities (the major city bus routes would also have to be bought up to afford the smaller routes). This would be the fastest and cheapest solution, but maintains a dirty diesel fleet of buses. It's worth noting that in this first option since Canada Post is already delivering mail daily to these communities, the parcels could be carried along with the buses, saving a trip to each location (and lessening the environmental impact since buses are likely marginally worse than the Canada Post trucks).
A better option might be to pay Greyhound to run the lines while the governments invest in a large-scale commuter rail project, thereby creating hundreds to thousands of jobs (something "Canada's Economic Action Plan" seems to have been failing to do) across the country. The rail system could even be expanded to cover the entire country.
Of course, both of these options being far too interventionist by nature will likely give way to the Friedmanite Third Way of saying screw the small communities that aren't profitable and let them pay for gas to get to town.
Although, perhaps with an NDP government, Manitoba may actually be able to make some real changes here (they supposedly already demand that Greyhound service all routes or none).


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